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Post by Eric Ling on Dec 6, 2004 5:33:05 GMT -5
Okay okay I get the hint !
Starting a new thread - Traditional vs New Cranes to talk about the "evolution" of Cranes.
White Crane Tai Chi - sounds good. Maybe if I am not so caught up with unraveling the "old stuff", I'll get around to formulating this.
In the meantime, let's concentrate on Hung Gar here!
You happy now, you crazzzzzy Dutchman? hehehehe
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Post by essence on Dec 6, 2004 5:34:45 GMT -5
Good day Evert.
I am unfamiliar with the technique Needle at the Sea Bottom. I have heard about this many times but no one has explained it to me, maybe you could shed some light on this for me?
Also, I might be mistaken, but was Sifu Dong Mu Yao in a film called Push Hands about an elderly Chinese in USA who feels out of place and the daughter-in-law always scolds him?
Warmest regards,
Tze Hou
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Post by Eric Ling on Dec 6, 2004 9:56:36 GMT -5
Good day Evert. I am unfamiliar with the technique Needle at the Sea Bottom. I have heard about this many times but no one has explained it to me, maybe you could shed some light on this for me? Also, I might be mistaken, but was Sifu Dong Mu Yao in a film called Push Hands about an elderly Chinese in USA who feels out of place and the daughter-in-law always scolds him? Warmest regards, Tze Hou Tze Hou, I don't know the Hakka's version but a example of Tai Chi's "Seeking Needle" was posted in the "Tai Chi Fighting" thread a while back by me. Anyway, reproducing it here. No, I don't think we are talking about Sifu Dong in that movie - some Taiwanese actor actually.  |
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Post by essence on Dec 6, 2004 20:34:46 GMT -5
Good day Eric.
Ah I see, so the block on the attack at the collarbone sets up the wrist lock? Very nice technique.
Warmest regards,
Tze Hou
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Post by Eric Ling on Dec 6, 2004 21:03:49 GMT -5
Tze Hou, There are a few ways to do this technique. One is to grab a high gate attack and raise opponent's arm a bit for you to go under and then behind your opponent. As you are moving, you lower your body and use this lowering to throw your opponent to the front - like in the pic. A little like what a Aikido player might do. Another is a straight on counter.You grab a right high gate attack with your right hand and pull opponent in and down. Use the left hand to add to the downward drive. The second technique works with good timing - grab and step back and the hands get into position nicely. This will bring the opponent face down to the floor very quickly and denying him the chance to retaliate.  |
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Post by essence on Dec 6, 2004 21:33:18 GMT -5
Good day Eric.
I see, so indeed it is a form of Chin Na. Both the techniques you described sound very Aikido-ish to me, many pictures of Steven Seagal doing it.
I cannot seem to recall if I have done this in my Hung Gar, but I think in my lineage, I have seen my Sifu and Sihing do their Gung Ji Fook Fu Kuen with such a technique, albeit with a Tiger flavour.
Seung Fu Jow to bridge before driagging opponent back and down. Comments Evert?
Warmest regards,
Tze Hou
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Post by Nataraya on Dec 7, 2004 2:56:06 GMT -5
In fact it is very Aikido'isch because it belongs to the category of Kum La/ Qinna. It depend upon the situation if you use Diem/ Dian or a controling technique. A wrist lock, then you can press the opponent - with the needle arm - done to the ground. As usual, there are many variations and skills that can be executed.
For instance in the Crane technique "Searching for the shrimps" there is a beak- hook, after the kick, before pecking down. This pecking (can) have the same quality as 'Needle'. because the hook bring the opponent down while the Needle/ peck is there to point a vital spot......
Tze Hou I think you refer to the "White Tiger grabs the Sand"? Short pull followed by a double panther strike (in our branch). A sequence from Fu Hoc.
Collarbone can be broken easily, and more important, there is an important nerve center (plexus brachialis) behind the collar bone. Pointed stimulation might paralyse the arm, while a broken collarbone makes it impossible to use the arm properly....... many roads that lead to the top of the mountain.
Warm regards,
Evert.
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Post by Eric Ling on Dec 7, 2004 4:37:56 GMT -5
Collarbone can be broken easily, and more important, there is an important nerve center (plexus brachialis) behind the collar bone. Pointed stimulation might paralyse the arm, while a broken collarbone makes it impossible to use the arm properly....... many roads that lead to the top of the mountain. Warm regards, Evert. Evert, Tai Chor got a technique using double tiger claw chin-na to the collar bone area. You reach out with double claw like in "Twin Tigers Pushing Mountain" then pull in to push out again. Not into pather paws like in Fu-Hoc but more like willow-palms. This move is found in the 2nd San Chiem - Ti Chiem or Earth Battle. |
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Post by essence on Dec 7, 2004 5:09:54 GMT -5
Good day Evert. It is definitely GGFFK that they do it in, although, I think this may be one of those "signatures" added to the form to identify the lineage?  The 4th picture of the 4th row of GM Lam Sai Wing, we do the Seung Fu Jow which is followed by clawing and shifting backwards, which would equate to pulling the opponent towards you and down. It is also done 3 times and on the 3rd time, my Sihings slap the floor with both hands which indicated to me that it is meant to bring the opponent to the floor. Do you do it this technique as such or is it different in your branch? Warmest regards, Tze Hou |
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Post by Nataraya on Dec 7, 2004 8:22:16 GMT -5
Tze Hou,
If I understand it correctly, you are refereing to "Cat Washes its face"? This is a famous claw session in Hung Kuen, and in fact is NOT a Tiger claw. One claw follows the other. In this particular posture - with the right foot in front - the let claw goes straight while the right claw moves like a swimming Dragon. Never seen there a Seung Fu Jau, even not in Chan Hon Chung's version.
In this case; left hand hold, while the right claw scratch.
Regards,
Evert.
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Post by essence on Dec 7, 2004 18:35:51 GMT -5
Good day Evert.
Yes you are correct. I just called it Seung Fu Jow because I do not know the name of the technique. Left hand holds, right hand claws. Do you do the pull back and down with this technique?
Again, to be sure, this is different from Cat Washes Whiskers correct? I will have to confirm with my Sifu on Monday when I see him for the last time before I go back home. Will confirm this technique with you again then.
Warmest regards,
Tze Hou
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Post by pitbull on Dec 9, 2004 20:20:02 GMT -5
anyone heard of Guangsheng a HG kwan in malaysia? i know theyre big in those parts...what do you guys know of them??
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Post by essence on Dec 10, 2004 6:09:42 GMT -5
Good day pitbull.
Unfortunately, I have not heard to them before.
Warmest regards,
Tze Hou
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Hungfist
Full Member
...gotta launder my Karma.
Posts: 120
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Post by Hungfist on Dec 11, 2004 11:43:21 GMT -5
Very strange discussion, this thread, with steps to all the sites. I am responsible for this too. We just let it happens..... Evert - Do you teach/practice Lau Family Fist? |
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Post by Nataraya on Dec 11, 2004 12:35:12 GMT -5
Correct, we have three forms of the Lau family style. Both the eight feet stick, as well as the first Lau Ga form is the same as in many other Hung Kuen schools. Although Lam (Yo) Lau Ga form is shorter and more fist orientated.
Our secondform is absolutely different then Chiu's Lau Ga Jeung (palm) technique. Our second version contains much Lohan and contains a symmetry in its pattern. Unique are the way to use the elbows, with the 'breaking neck' application.
Much is said about Lau family Boxing. Mainland have two versions, further it is named after some practitioners carrying the name Lau (Lam Yo + Britisch Jeremy Yau). Hahahaha, almost Crane Boxing family.
Many claim to have the 'one and only one'. A dark side of serious practitioners.
Kind regards,
Evert.
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